First know-what-I'm-growing-grow

[ShaggyGrower]

Hi @Cindy, yes the blue light in your led's would have helped your plant grow vegatively  with shorter internodes and so bushier as @LedCherryBerry says above.  

[ShaggyGrower]

DD & Nebula into their final 46ltr pots.

 

IC, JW & SS in 11ltr pots and watered 6litr with (426ppm 0.852ec) 6.66ph (total in nutes) after 3rd wk veg schedule half nutes
JW 2.39kg/5lb  3oz before. After r/o 1717ppm 3.434ec  5.91ph 5.8kg/ 11lb 13oz after 6lts above half nutes.
SS 2.62kg/5lb 13oz before. After r/o 1633ppm 3.266ec  6.02ph 5.7kg/ 11lb  8oz after 6lts above half nutes.
IC did not weigh before,.  After r/o 1432ppm 2.864ec  6.05ph 5.7kg/ 11lb  8oz after 6lts above half nutes.

[ShaggyGrower]

Girls are growing stronger now.

 

JW has joined DD & Nebula in big 46 litre pots.  I ran out of Coco Pro and Tropic Bat Mix so used some Coco Pro and some Micacle Gro (& Perlite).

 

DD & Nebula had a first big drink Sunday with 6 litres of half strength week 3 Shogun veg nutrients, then 6 litres of half strength week 3 veg nutrients with a teaspoon of molasses, then 6 litres of r/o water only (ppm ~40).  Run off was around 5 litres.  Figured the pots would have lots of nutes in the media so did not want to overload too much.  Don't think I'll have to be watered/fed for a week at least.

 

JW in the other big pot will likely join the perhaps-weekly DD & Nebula schedule on Sunday.

 

SS nearly needs transplanting in to a big pot, will give her until Wednesday (1 week since SS & IC last water/feed) or until the pot weighs 2.5kg.  Then I'll water with full strength nutes, wait a day, then transplant into unwatered big final pot.

 

IC getting there.

 

All plants are 5-7 inches tall with great side branching LSTing. I'm really enjoying doing the LSTing.  There are four sets of two side branches on all but IC, and some of those side branches have been topped twice.  Lots of new tops appearing. I use a cuticle remover to top very, very early and it seems to be working.  

 

Oh, and the girls have guest.  Bill the Ladybug has moved in.  He had a wander around then I gave him some sugar water and he's in heaven & sleeping.  Hopefully any little critters in there he can munch for me.  Any of his buddies I see roaming around looking for a nice place to stay, I'll kidnap for my tent.

 

Light cycle is 19/5 @ 600w of HPS. Temps are up to 85 during lights on, down to 72 lights off.

 

[ShaggyGrower]

All the girls in their final 46 litre pots now.  SS and IC the last to go in theirs today.  Watered/fed as the other earlier with half a veg week three feeding in 12 litres (ppm 450 ph 6.2), the second 6l of those 12l having some molasses mixed in.

It's day 50 (from germination) for DD & Nebula.

It's day 37 (from germination) for IC & JW.

It's day 33 (from germination) for SS.

 

The switch to flowering is a week or two away. My LSTing & lollypopping means they don't grow as fast as they could, but they've all got some lovely side training on them so I'm very happy with my LST investment.

 

I this photo we have SS (top left) DD (top right) JW (middle) IC (bottom left) Nebula (bottom right).  Each plant has four shoot levels (including the top), level 1 has first two shoots nipped off (early lollypopping), level 2 has first side shoots nipped off. Levels 3 & 4 have also been topped.

 

I won't be SCRoGing for a while until they have some height (another 12 inches).  As an example, JW (middle plant) is 3 inches tall from ground to level 4 (top) node.  The level 4 nodes stretch 4 inches, level 3 nodes stretch 6.5 inches and is 2 inches from side of pot and ready to head upwards (level 2 & 1 are 5.5 inches & 5 inches respectively). 

[ShaggyGrower]

Made the decision last night to switch these into flowering (12/12) from veg (19/5).  So, they're lights on at 7am and lights off at 7pm. Cconsidering the White Rhino comp', I'll need the big tent by around 1st Feb (in 62 days).

 

Flowering estimates: DD is 63-70 days; Nebula 60-65 days; JW 60 days; SS 56-63 days; IC 55-60 days.

 

 

[LedCherryBerry]

Hey Shaggy,

2 things.

1. GODDAMN THEY LOOK GORGEOUS!
2. White Rhino Competition ends the 1st of june. 
This being said, you can leave those girls in the flowering tent for another 10 weeks. Let me explain.

White Rhino is an indica dominant that will flower in 7-8 weeks.
If you start Rhinos the 1st of January, in the 18-6 tent, they can VEG for 10 weeks and you'd still have 8 weeks for BLOOM, 1 per Dry and 1 per Cure.
This gives you, from now, another 10 weeks of blooming for those, which are 8 days more than you calculated.

I'm saying this because i'm afraid i've cut my hybrid a bit too early (even tho the high is freaking strong), so you don't repeat the same error and have better results than me.


I can't wait for the competition. I have 1 chair, but it'll be occupied for a LOT of diaries. 
Yours on top!

Peace!

[ShaggyGrower]

Hi @LedCherryBerry.

 

Thanks re. the girls. Yup they're looking very happy.

 

I read on the Greenhouse website that White Rhino (feminised) takes "9 weeks, with a yield up to 900 gr/m²." and that's under ideal conditions says Arjan, so I'll probably add a couple of weeks for my setup: https://shop.greenhouseseeds.nl/white-rhino-feminised.html

 

So working backwards, I'll need to start flowering mid March to defo finish in time. Plus six weeks of veg and two weeks of seedling is mid Jan germination at the latest, unless I've done my math wrong.

 

 

 

 

 

[LedCherryBerry]

My bad, sorry.
I read that on other websites re-selling the same seeds (or at least what they say), but was on mobile and couldn't find ghs'.
I'll change my mind to 9 weeks of flowering, although i'm finished, and waiting for the nuggets to dry.

Btw, i forgot to ask. What plant is that in the middle? Spathiphyllum? I totally have no idea.

[ShaggyGrower]

I've no idea either what that plant is in the middle, just a house plant that was not looking happy so decided to give it (and a couple of others) some 'sun'.

[ShaggyGrower]

DD, Nebula and JW all watered today with 12 litres.  DD & Nebula were last watered 7 days ago in their 46l pots. JW was last watered when in it's 11 litre pot 12 days ago.

 

RO water in: 59ppm; 0.118ec; 8.0ph.

After full strength Week 1 Shogun nut regime [1]: 5.8ph; 1368ppm; 2.736ec. 

Run off JW: 5.33ph; 3908ppm; 7.8ec (no hydrogen peroxide) (quite acidic and VERY high ppm - that'll be the Miracle grow and I guess I'll be having issues with JW due to that - potential doh!  In a week or so I will flush this plant with only Run Off)

DD 5.35ph after nutes. Run off DD:   6.05ph, 3.244ec 1622ppm (with 12ml of hydrogen peroxide).

Nebula 5.11ph 1177ppm 2.354ec after nutes. Run off was 6.1ph 1512ppm 3.024ec   (24ml of hydrogen peroxide).

 

DD & Nebula are stretching really nicely and are ~ 11 inches tall. 

 

JW was a little stunted (although great LSTing) but I think that's a moisture issue which should resolve in the next couple of days - I think I can see some pre-flowers as well.

 

Humidity 39-74%; Temps 28-18C; 12/12; 660w HPS 18 inches from closest canopy. 

 

I've taken 50+ internal side shoots off DD & Nebula to focus growth where I would like it (lets see if they cooperate - they seems to be).

[1] -  http://shogunfertilisers.com/feedcharts/

Edited December 4, 2017 by ShaggyGrower
added photo

[LedCherryBerry]

Miracle Gro is one of the most hated soils in weed growing.
Some say is the best, but most say it sucks.
It has the catchiest name, for the worst product.

Point is, slow release nutes are a BAD thing for weed.
What you can try is a flush on that plant, in a way you try to remove most of the slow-release nutes, but i've NEVER tried MG so i don't really know if it's worth the try.
What i can tell you is that nute burn is really, really a pain in the ass to heal. ESPECIALLY on young plants that cannot uptake so much nutes.

I'd consider asking @Cannabissapean or @Dust, they might have more insights than i do.

Peace!

[ShaggyGrower]

Hi @LedCherryBerry,

 

My view is slow release is bad if added too late.  Miracle Gro All Purpose Compost slow releases over 3 months (their site says), so if used early it should have all released half way through flowering.  I used 30% MG in the JW pot (with 40% coco and 30% perlite) so hopefully that's not a lot to get released and/or flushed out later.

 

I'm thinking of using MG (and perlite) for seedlings and early veg stage (so in small and medium sized pots) but not later (when they get moved to big pots) in future.

 

I used MG on my bagseed grow.  I must have flushed ok as it smokes great and I've had some ace reviews from friends whom I've given samples.

 

[ShaggyGrower]

Thanks @Cindy. I'm very happy with them.

 

Here's a shot of JW, and Bill the Ladybird on Nebula.

[LedCherryBerry]

Hey sal,

I don't know if they've been announced. I'm a humble user like y'all :3
I'm just hoping that we all get to be participants. I'd love to see our works put into comparison, same plant but different enviroment and techniques. 
Should be very, very interesting.

I care about the 'actual' competition. I compete to see others work and techniques, and maybe learn.
I consider myself a winner if i get to participate, not if i win the contest. 

The only down to this contest is that we cannot share our works with each other. I'd love to let ya guys taste the girls i've just harvested :3

[ShaggyGrower]

Plant weigh in today to see how far they are from requiring watering/feeding.

 

DD 13.0kg

Nebula 13.4kg

JW 16.3 kg

IC 13.5kg

SS 14.4kg.

 

Fairly sure a pre-watered 46l container with media weighed 12kg, so tomorrow should be good for watering/feeding.

DD, Nebula and JW were last watered/fed last Monday; IC & SS were a while ago (30th November).

 

All except JW will get a full feed, JW will get a flush first..

Today, I have mostly been making snowmen.

[ShaggyGrower]

Feeding day.  Ph meter broke, again - booo!  So ph done by finger-in-the-air & remembering from last time (ie, after nutes and ro, water a little alkaline so give a little ph down).

 

DD 12.0kg to start; 12l @ 1000ppm in;  2.4l out of 1338ppm out
Nebula  12.5kg to start; 12l @ 1070ppm in; 1.9l of 1695ppm out (a bit high)
JW  15.5kg to start; - will feed/water in a few days
IC  12.8kg to start; 12l @ 1001ppm in; 3.6l of 745ppm out
SS  13.5kg to start; 12l @ 978ppm in; 3.3l of 885ppm out

All plants looking great with lots of stretching going on and no deficiencies/excesses visible.  The LST'd side shoots have nearly reached the side of the pots (15cm) and are already the same length in height as they are in width (20cm).  I might not even need the SCRoG net as the LSTing is doing the job fine (as per @I'm Sal) .  Lots of pre-flowers but not buds coming through yet (perhaps another week or two).

 

Temps between 20-28C; humidity 45-60%; 12/12; 660w (610w actual draw).  CO2 bubblers doing well in there I think.

(ps, think memory was faulty and 12lbs (7kg) was the dry weight for 46l pots, not 12kg, so perhaps could have left a few days longer)

 

For the record, my grow is for my own use.  I will of course give some away to friends, and if they want to offer some wine, diy help, dinner, etc, in return, I'm ok with that.  My reasons for growing is I'm fed up of not knowing what I'm smoking, & cost.  I'd like to know what I'm smoking ('cause I've grown it) and keep costs down.

Photo's in the next post.
 

[ShaggyGrower]

First photo shows the plants filling up my area.

Second is JW , a 75% sativa and it sure is stretching (42cm from media).

Third is also JW and shows the topping & LSTing (and size).

Fourth is IC (60% indica). IC has three nodes not four like all the others.

Fifth is DD, also a 75% sativa and stretching.

Sixth is the internals of DD.

Finally seventh photo is of IC which was splayed open yesterday and filled in over night.

 

In the top photo we have DD top left; Nebula top right; SS middle; IC bottom left; JW bottom right.

[ShaggyGrower]

Emergency flush of JW yesterday.  Earlier feedings/RO showed a VERY high EC and acidic media.  Some slight leaf burn appearing on top new fan leaf tips, so decided to mega-flush.  Note the JW was the one having Miracle Gro instead of Bat mix which I ran out of.

 

12l RO water 30ppm ph'd to 5.8 with 24ml of Hydrogen Peroxide (HP) only.  5.22ph out (Acidic!).  Another 12l with ph at natural 7.4 & HP.  5.12ph - WORSE! Another 12l with natural RO & HP. ph now 6.58.  6l of half nutes, final run off is ph 5.7 (ok) and 1.0ec (500ppm).  EC was 4.0, yup 2000ppm!  

 

 

[LedCherryBerry]

47 minutes ago, ShaggyGrower said:

Emergency flush of JW yesterday.  Earlier feedings/RO showed a VERY high EC and acidic media.  Some slight leaf burn appearing on top new fan leaf tips, so decided to mega-flush.  Note the JW was the one having Miracle Gro instead of Bat mix which I ran out of.

 

12l RO water 30ppm ph'd to 5.8 with 24ml of Hydrogen Peroxide (HP) only.  5.22ph out (Acidic!).  Another 12l with ph at natural 7.4 & HP.  5.12ph - WORSE! Another 12l with natural RO & HP. ph now 6.58.  6l of half nutes, final run off is ph 5.7 (ok) and 1.0ec (500ppm).  EC was 4.0, yup 2000ppm!  

 

 

Damn man, sorry to hear of your inconveniences.. 
But flushing was the only and best option you had. Well done.
Don't worry if after the flush you'll see still some yellowing: that might be due to the nute build-up still in the plant and in the roots.
She'll need a couple weeks to recover overall imho.

Did you use 3% or 35% HP? I was told to use the 3,6% version, as you need to put really too much to fuck up. Still, my heart races when i hear some bubbling hehehe.. 

Sorry for the question, could you please link me the ppm meter you're using (or a similar one)?
I am discovering ppm right now. Don't judge me heheheh
Thank you in advance :3

Peace!

[ShaggyGrower]

No worries @LedCherryBerry, I saw the potential for this inconvenience coming as I was pouring the Miracle Gro in the pot when I had ran out of Tropic Bat Mix.

 

The whole episode got me thinking about when I should and should not perhaps use enriched media vs clean-ish media (for future grows).  I now figure it's ok a little at the start (seedling, small pot) and the bulk during early veg (11l pot) but none in late veg/flour (46l pot) when I want to control nute intake via the syringe.  Just perlite, coco & liquid nutes in 46l pots.

 

It's my first proper grow, so I have 5 plants & pots to learn with while I'm growing, so trying slightly different things out on the different plants.

 

JW (in fact they all) looks super healthy, even with 1mm of tip burn on a few fresh leaves.  75% Sativa.  Internodal length on the stretch is 4inches/10cm.  46cm tall, the tallest by 3cm.  I have 55cm of vertical grow height left for them, so that should be enough.

 

The HP I'm using is 3% and using 1ml/litre.  Figure HP will help give the roots some oxygen while the roots are awash with fresh watering.  Fresh watering fills in the oxygen gaps in the media the roots would go for when media dry/drying.  Plus the added benefit the HP might kills some gnat fly larva along the way.  Bill the Ladybug is still in there as I spotted him again this morning.

 

The ppm/ec gadget is this one: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00N1SD5ZU/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

 

[LedCherryBerry]

9 minutes ago, ShaggyGrower said:

No worries @LedCherryBerry, I saw the potential for this inconvenience coming as I was pouring the Miracle Gro in the pot when I had ran out of Tropic Bat Mix.

 

The whole episode got me thinking about when I should and should not perhaps use enriched media vs clean-ish media (for future grows).  I now figure it's ok a little at the start (seedling, small pot) and the bulk during early veg (11l pot) but none in late veg/flour (46l pot) when I want to control nute intake via the syringe.  Just perlite, coco & liquid nutes in 46l pots.

 

It's my first proper grow, so I have 5 plants & pots to learn with while I'm growing, so trying slightly different things out on the different plants.

 

JW (in fact they all) looks super healthy, even with 1mm of tip burn on a few fresh leaves.  75% Sativa.  Internodal length on the stretch is 4inches/10cm.  46cm tall, the tallest by 3cm.  I have 55cm of vertical grow height left for them, so that should be enough.

 

The HP I'm using is 3% and using 1ml/litre.  Figure HP will help give the roots some oxygen while the roots are awash with fresh watering.  Fresh watering fills in the oxygen gaps in the media the roots would go for when media dry/drying.  Plus the added benefit the HP might kills some gnat fly larva along the way.  Bill the Ladybug is still in there as I spotted him again this morning.

 

The ppm/ec gadget is this one: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00N1SD5ZU/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

 

Hey Man,

Yeah, i've heard countless times that Miracle Gro isn't suitable for weed grow etc etc.. You confirm what i've heard so far.
I'm sorry to hear it tho. Mixing it was a good solution, but i'm sorry it didn't work out properly..
Anyway, I'm sure JW will recover. If you noticed it and acted quick enough it'll recover as of nothing happened.

Be aware that sativas stretch 200-300%, so you could end up with either a 1m plant, or a 3m plant. 
I'm totally not an expert, but if you see some real stretch i would consider supercropping (at least on that one).
I think i lost the post, i don't remember if your girls are already 12-12ing or still under 18-6.

I used the 3,6% at 15 ml/lt. It killed most of the flies, the larvae, but left the roots well. 
I was worried i had overkilled it, but the plants seemed to go better after that. Huh.
I think the solution you're using (1-2 ml/lt) is indicated for the 35% version. If you do some math, i actually used a 1.5ML/LT of a 36% and had zero problems.
But PLEASE read more on this as i might have been VERY VERY LUCKY and don't even know.

Thank you very much for the meter. It doesn't even cost that big of a fortune (more or less 15 euros + delivery).


Please take a photo of Bill! I totally missed that you put a ladybug in there! That is so lovely!! :3
Peace!

[ShaggyGrower]

I've also read that Miracle Gro isn't suitable for weed grow, and have tried to find out why.  Finding out why (slow release of nutrients at the wrong time) got me thinking about when it would be bad to use and when good, ie, when do you want slow release and when don't you.  I figure slow release early on is ok but not later.  Miracle Gro allegedly last 3 months, so using at early on means it will be released by early/mid flowering.  Perfect (imv) for seedling/early veg pots (1l & 11l) and will be all released when that media gets diluted during the transplant into 46l pots which won't have MG. Any rational argument against the above and I'm all ears

I'm hoping my topping/fimming and LSTing will keep the height to 1m [1].  Plant sheet says between 110-130cm for the various plants au natural. There's a max 115cm of space for them.  12/12 since 1st Dec.

 

It's just a mild dose of HP for the unstable O2 molecule.  Every little helps Defo 3% as it say so on the bottle.

 

Bill is in one of my past photo's - see if you can spot him 

 

Just been in moving the pots around again and doing some trimming.  All pots are still movable (handy for watering, weighing, trimming, etc) and I'm still deliberating their final configuration (if there will indeed ever be a final one).

 

Oh, I have  spray I used once or twice a day. It is ph'd at 7.5 with potassium silicate (6%) added (silicone remains disolved > 7.0ph).  It's in the spray as the nute feed solution is a much lower ph at which the silicone would not be dissolved.

[1] - this grow I think I learned that one can top/fim to much; a cuticle remover is a great early topping tool; topping/fimming really stunts growth but it's a trade off with plant shape & worth it; trim shoots (unless you want clones) early not leaves.
 

[LedCherryBerry]

I have no arguments against yours. 
There's just a little thing: i don't think miracle gro will dilute when you transplant. What i'm afraid it'll do is to direct the slow-release nutes in the media without slow-release. A sort of Entropy, if you know what i mean. This would, yes, dilute the miracle gro, but also contaminate the other clean media. What i would do with miracle gro is to slowly shower-flush it 2-3 times BEFORE mixing it with other media. In this way i would have removed most of the slow-release nutes.
This is just thoughts tho, all hypothetical. 

I found that topping (in my case) stomped the growth for a week, to then resume without problems. I never tried fimming.
I believe the plant stops growing not just because of stress, but because she needs to readapt her roots to feed other zones.
What you can do is LST her in a spiral way. Spiralizing the branches will let them grow to their full height, but indeed with a reduced height (they're inclined).
I did spiral-lst on a clone long time ago. The longest branch was 40cm, but in height (LST'ed) was only 28cm. My spiralization was too hard, but it worked.
Tellin you this Just in case the plant results over the expectancy
Again, the first sativa dominant i grew was the bagseed i just completed, so i don't really know what to expect with sativas and their stretch.
I had problems with the stretch of an apparent indica (was expected to grow 60-90cm, came out to be 145 LOL), but i guess that was an isolated case. Either way, that plant was a monster.

I'll try looking for Bill as soon as i get back home!
Also i should look for one to put in my tent. 

Final configs are bullshit for me. I change pot positions each time i water, for 2 simple reasons:

1. I rotate the plants for better light distribution;
2. I can't fucking remember the positions. Even if i take photos, i can't realize how the fuck i managed to fit them like that. Every goddamn time.

Sooo, yea. Sorry for the long chit-chat.
Peace!

[ShaggyGrower]

Bill (the Ladybug), in the middle of DD.

[LedCherryBerry]

There it is! Hey Bill!
I'm sorry i didn't answer ya yesterday, but i was so tired i died on the couch at 10pm like a baby.
Is Bill yellow? I can't distinguish the colours with all that green

Anyway your plants are looking SO healthy! Very well done!