12/12 from seed......

[firefighter]

I'm sorry but you are wrong. 12/12 from seed method doesn't mean plants get only 12/12 cycle. Here have a read:

http://www.growweedeasy.com/12-12-from-seed-force-flower

You shouldn't express your opinions on methods you don't know,

 

Quotation from that article you mentioned:

 

"As soon as the seed sprouts through the surface it is given a light regimen of 12 hours on/12 hours off"

So there is no 18/6 EVER when you grow 12/12...

 

or just read it here:

http://www.nomercyseeds.eu/en/growinfo/12-12-system.htm

 

I tried it seeral times and thee are pics of that here in that forum. maybe you can show us your 12/12 pics too?

 

 

[Vertox]

I gurss i was not clear enuff..

Yes it is a difference if you let them get mature or not before going in to this cycle.

And yes it will affect your ResinProduction.

Im not telling you what i read somewhere i tested this among pretty much everything i could think of that was doable with my recources.

This exaact test was made with 100Plants 5Strains 20 each. with a second 100 simultaniously growing on normal Cycle.

The Normal Cycle dide need 7-10 Days more than the 12/12 ones one Strain killed it self pretty early in the 12/12 Room whilest it was fine in the normal Cycle.

The Plants over alll could hold them selfs at least with a normal Cycle...

The 12/12 Teant had way more issues even tho conditions were same for both Rooms, they had BudRot on big buds on low Humidity, same Strain had no Budrot what so ever tho in the norm Cycle room at same Conditions.

The WhiteWidow didnt even care for shit tho she went straight in both Rooms no problem only difference was she didnt pack on nearly as much Resin as the one under norm Cycle. that was the Case for pretty much every single Plant.

So like i said sure its viable for some People but i would never ever title it as "advanced" or "growtechniwue" at all as it just isnt.

This led me to give up on it as it didnt seem any stable or reliable. Im searching for the highest possible Quality and not on Time.

Btw Roots are not affected by this as they dont need light to grow and even if you light 12/12 from seed your in Veg until she gets mature so it will develop the same as a norm cycle Plant

Cheers

[leyus]

 

I'm sorry but you are wrong. 12/12 from seed method doesn't mean plants get only 12/12 cycle. Here have a read:

http://www.growweedeasy.com/12-12-from-seed-force-flower

You shouldn't express your opinions on methods you don't know,

 

Quotation from that article you mentioned:

 

"As soon as the seed sprouts through the surface it is given a light regimen of 12 hours on/12 hours off"

So there is no 18/6 EVER when you grow 12/12...

 

or just read it here:

http://www.nomercyseeds.eu/en/growinfo/12-12-system.htm

 

I tried it seeral times and thee are pics of that here in that forum. maybe you can show us your 12/12 pics too?

 

 

 

I pasted wrong link Damn can't be bothered with searching for this article again maybe later.

 

The point is: Give me one difference between starting 12/12 from day 1 and starting 12/12 at 3-4 weeks when plants reach sexual maturity. It is same method same result except that you don't mess with seedlings grow which won't flower anyway.

 

My pictures are in my signature, SCROG one was 12/12 from seed (switched to 12/12 at 21 days). Now I am going main-lining with 8 different strains and I will try to go 12/12 again (if I can reach 4 main branches in that time and probably I will) pictures will be again in the same Photobucket of mine).

 

I had great success with this method I grew Jack Herer from GHS and Northern Lights from Homegrown Fantaseeds. Both resulted in quality that is as good if not superior then my 9 weeks vegging grow and much smaller yield (JH strength beats every single other strain in my stash 12/12 or vegged). 

 

[leyus]

I gurss i was not clear enuff..

Yes it is a difference if you let them get mature or not before going in to this cycle.

And yes it will affect your ResinProduction.

Im not telling you what i read somewhere i tested this among pretty much everything i could think of that was doable with my recources.

This exaact test was made with 100Plants 5Strains 20 each. with a second 100 simultaniously growing on normal Cycle.

The Normal Cycle dide need 7-10 Days more than the 12/12 ones one Strain killed it self pretty early in the 12/12 Room whilest it was fine in the normal Cycle.

The Plants over alll could hold them selfs at least with a normal Cycle...

The 12/12 Teant had way more issues even tho conditions were same for both Rooms, they had BudRot on big buds on low Humidity, same Strain had no Budrot what so ever tho in the norm Cycle room at same Conditions.

The WhiteWidow didnt even care for shit tho she went straight in both Rooms no problem only difference was she didnt pack on nearly as much Resin as the one under norm Cycle. that was the Case for pretty much every single Plant.

So like i said sure its viable for some People but i would never ever title it as "advanced" or "growtechniwue" at all as it just isnt.

This led me to give up on it as it didnt seem any stable or reliable. Im searching for the highest possible Quality and not on Time.

Btw Roots are not affected by this as they dont need light to grow and even if you light 12/12 from seed your in Veg until she gets mature so it will develop the same as a norm cycle Plant

Cheers

Those are surprising results for me. I can only say I didn't experience any of that, but also my test was not as big. I have grown outdoor for over 10 years so 12/12 from seed I've done was as good if not better then my outdoor grows, and better then my vegged indoor grow (of course not in terms of yield ). But maybe because I didn't stress seedlings with 12/12 i always considered this method to be done incorrectly if starting 12/12 from day 1 since it didn't speed up anything but produced shorter and smaller plants. I don't know why people would start from 12/12 day 1 unless they grow in PC case etc. 

 

AS for resign again amount of resign got a lot to do with strength and GHS Jack Herer form 12/12 kills all my indoor competition and most of my outdoor. But again except for Northern Lights I didn't grew same strain twice in 2 different conditions, and my Jack Herer was grown in 12/12 method and not with vegging method. 

I've heard rumors that some strains don't cope that well with 12/12 but I never heard which strains are those. Overall I was happy with method, I've done it as advanced users recommended (switch to 12/12 asap not on day 1) and I still smoke that weed man And it is a bloody good weed  

[jankahar]

I gurss i was not clear enuff..

Yes it is a difference if you let them get mature or not before going in to this cycle.

And yes it will affect your ResinProduction.

Im not telling you what i read somewhere i tested this among pretty much everything i could think of that was doable with my recources.

This exaact test was made with 100Plants 5Strains 20 each. with a second 100 simultaniously growing on normal Cycle.

The Normal Cycle dide need 7-10 Days more than the 12/12 ones one Strain killed it self pretty early in the 12/12 Room whilest it was fine in the normal Cycle.

The Plants over alll could hold them selfs at least with a normal Cycle...

The 12/12 Teant had way more issues even tho conditions were same for both Rooms, they had BudRot on big buds on low Humidity, same Strain had no Budrot what so ever tho in the norm Cycle room at same Conditions.

The WhiteWidow didnt even care for shit tho she went straight in both Rooms no problem only difference was she didnt pack on nearly as much Resin as the one under norm Cycle. that was the Case for pretty much every single Plant.

So like i said sure its viable for some People but i would never ever title it as "advanced" or "growtechniwue" at all as it just isnt.

This led me to give up on it as it didnt seem any stable or reliable. Im searching for the highest possible Quality and not on Time.

Btw Roots are not affected by this as they dont need light to grow and even if you light 12/12 from seed your in Veg until she gets mature so it will develop the same as a norm cycle Plant

Cheers

 

you make no sense by blaiming the 12/12 for grower errors, clear grower errors. and you claim about these big tests that no one has ever seen or heard of or no lab has ever tested, so i will question your scientific testing skills again and say its bs claims that you didnt actually test properly

 

i question the tents had identical control, in fact you just told it in the post. and how does the plant kill it self on its own   again you killed that plant not the light cycle lol

 

are you sure the 12/12 plants didnt have N buildup lol

[jankahar]

''and even if you light 12/12 from seed your in Veg until she gets mature so it will develop the same as a norm cycle Plant''      plz what are you trying to say? the same thing we just said?

[leyus]

There can be thousands of reasons why his experiment fail which he might not be aware of, for example confirmation bias.

 

Also he mention some strains go "full retard" in 12/12 method. I assume he meant heavy sativa dominant strain. I am now going to grow Kali mist from Serious Seeds and AUH#1 from GHS using what I consider 12/12 however knowing that I have 2 sativa plants in my multi-strain (8 strains) grow I will fallow DJ Short and go 11/13 simply sativa plants and sativa dominant can keep vegging in 12/12 and maybe especially if that is all they experience (again watch my signature for pictures and I will post some pictures of AUH#1 here too). Maybe he wasn't aware of that and that is what happend (although it is hard to say what he means by going full retard).

As for closing argument in this discussion that is going nowhere. Some of you might have had even multiple bad experiences with 12/12 from seed, some of us might have had multiple good experiences with it. If you google 12/12 from seed journal or diary , plenty of people starts 12/12 from day 1 (which is as I mention mistake in this method if you look for advanced advise from experienced growers and articles they will explain as they did to me that 12/12 from seed goal is to achieve yield in shortest possible time and first 3 weeks of 12/12 doesn't speed up anything) and even them get perfectly good results. If that is not enough google PC case grow/journal/diary when they are forced to start 12/12 from day 1. And again check how many plants "killed themselves" or went "full retard" whatever those scientific expressions mean. I guarantee you it is not many or growers fault will be obvious. Finally check in how many places on earth those plants almost never get more then 12 hours of light and they grow their just fine. Check autoflowering plants that are used to short days and extreme cold due to ruderalis genes, and people give them 24h light instead and nice heat and they don't kill themselves There is a reason why it is called weed, it simply grows almost no matter what even if you totally mess light cycle at worst to survive it will hermie. Reality is that light cycle won't change genotype. 

[Vertox]

I see there is kind af a fanboying going on for it..

Well like i said there are the results of my Tests.

Growingerror ? 1 Strain just completly fucks up under 12/12 and is perfectly fine on the normal cycle and thats a Growers fault ? logic..

jankahar i know you dont like me but why cant you stay polite ? Is there a need to be so asshatted about everything on such a harmonic Place like this Forum?

Sure noone ever saw those Grows as they would get me a life in Jail where i live. I would gladly share more.

What i mean by going full retard is that it was not usable for any gain. Buds never formed properly and it was a mess of alsmost 3 meter high Plants not holding a single Branch on its own Yielding minimum amounts of bad Quality Weed.

Final thing to say is i grew for 12 years now im breeding my own Strains since ca 9 years and im pretty sure my knowlage on Growing is not the Issue, as i said "I personally am not a Fan of it" i never said its not gonna work. 

Sorry but i cant even find one Growjurnal on the internet about those strains at all let alone 12/12 just cause there are not Genetics you can buy mostly. But if you can i would be glad to see a nice dr.Greenspoon that was grown under 12/12, and thats not even a real sissygenethics

 

cheers

[leyus]

I see there is kind af a fanboying going on for it..

Well like i said there are the results of my Tests.

Growingerror ? 1 Strain just completly fucks up under 12/12 and is perfectly fine on the normal cycle and thats a Growers fault ? logic..

jankahar i know you dont like me but why cant you stay polite ? Is there a need to be so asshatted about everything on such a harmonic Place like this Forum?

Sure noone ever saw those Grows as they would get me a life in Jail where i live. I would gladly share more.

What i mean by going full retard is that it was not usable for any gain. Buds never formed properly and it was a mess of alsmost 3 meter high Plants not holding a single Branch on its own Yielding minimum amounts of bad Quality Weed.

Final thing to say is i grew for 12 years now im breeding my own Strains since ca 9 years and im pretty sure my knowlage on Growing is not the Issue, as i said "I personally am not a Fan of it" i never said its not gonna work. 

Sorry but i cant even find one Growjurnal on the internet about those strains at all let alone 12/12 just cause there are not Genetics you can buy mostly. But if you can i would be glad to see a nice dr.Greenspoon that was grown under 12/12, and thats not even a real sissygenethics

 

cheers

 Most forums have special section for 12/12 from seeds and 99% of genetics is doing fine you have test that no one ever seen. Lets agree that only your best in the world genetics does bad in 12/12 from seed. Nothing more to discuss here people who read this can by now go to 1000s of grow journals all over the internet (including my sissy genetics from GHS Jack Herer and Homegrown Fantaseeds Northern Lights both done very well) and check for themselves then they can take into account your test of genetics no one ever seen except you and make their own opinions. You didn't added anything positive with your last post just called other genetics then you like sissy and picked one strain that almost no one grows which is not even that good (You can read why here: http://www.rollitup.org/t/best-worst-barneys-farm-strain-review.539581/) . This discussion is long time over, neither me or 1000s of growers with their 12/12 diaries noticed anything weird during this method and they got proof for it in pictures. When you redo the test one day and have journal and pictures to proof your claims... it will still mean nothing. Because reality is not changed by one exception from rule, there could be 1000s of variables that affected you and most likely it was confirmation bias. Majority of evidence proofs it as a good method and it is recommended for percy growers, certainly it is not a good method for you and that is not a reason for next 1000 growers to not use it, or not make their journals and not be happy with it as previous 1000s were. 

[Vertox]

Jack Herer is one of the Stronges genetics but ok ^^

Is like noone even reds what i say and just yells around so have a goot time yelling nonsense some more

have a nice evening

cheers

[Rabi]

with just 120cm of height in my indoor, 12/12 is the only way to grow pure (ish) sativas

some examples...

 

I think, from left to righ: Zamaldelica, Zamaldelica, Malawi x Jack Herer and Aoaxaca

 

[leyus]

Jack Herer is one of the Stronges genetics but ok ^^

Is like noone even reds what i say and just yells around so have a goot time yelling nonsense some more

have a nice evening

cheers

I don't see yelling but what do you expect? It's age of reason man, most people make their claims based on supporting evidence. There is thousands of journals, pictures and users (including mine) personal experience with 12/12 form seed method and suddenly you pop in, you make claims that no one have ever heard of, that are in contradiction to all the evidence we see with our own eyes, you have no evidence whatsoever, and you claim it is true because you are such a good grower and breeder that you never make mistakes so we must take what you say without questioning. That is more or less moral of your story. You can be great grower, who knows, you can be great breeder, maybe you are, but we have no proof of either but we do have pretty good hint that you are not good with 12/12 from seed and you make claims that suggest your opinion on subject is the law. Then you are surprised and offended. I think you should rethink your attitude. It's internet I have over 10 years of outdoor growing experience, does it make me good indoor grower? Well not really maybe slightly better then newbie. Does it make me good coco grower? I don't know I was organic whole my life I will try coco first time, I read as much as I could but I don't claim expertise in everything because I've done 1 experiment and failed at it where other clearly succeeded . And no one have whatsoever evidence of my experience here because my articles on growing from 15 years ago are in different language so I don't expect everyone to take my word for it I try to share my knowledge and learn new things in other cannabis growing methods and not be a person who pretends to know everything. I myself failed my first indoor setup using outdated knowledge and had to ask in forums for advice, no shame in that, sun and wind didn't prepare me to use right ventilation. 

[leyus]

with just 120cm of height in my indoor, 12/12 is the only way to grow pure (ish) sativas

some examples...

 

I think, from left to righ: Zamaldelica, Zamaldelica, Malawi x Jack Herer and Aoaxaca

 

Man this is amazing, is it from ACE seeds? Because I was thinking about Zamaldelica for a while but I was a bit afraid because of my limited space (1.6m). Did you had to  lolipop a lot to get such a main steam bud concentration ? 

[Rabi]

yea, it is from ACE.

I didnt do any lollipoping at all. I cut the N to soon and they lost all the fan leaves very early in flowering...

[leyus]

yea, it is from ACE.

I didnt do any lollipoping at all. I cut the N to soon and they lost all the fan leaves very early in flowering...

Wow fascinating structure ! Thanks man good to know. I will sleep better because my sativas in this grow worried me a bit. Did you already harvest ? Can you give me smoke report? I rly want this Zamaldelica for my next grow but I am unsure  between it and Panama. 

[Vertox]

Ok What ever man

 

"but we have no proof of either but we do have pretty good hint that you are not good with 12/12 from seed"

How so ? lol

Wild accusations flying again...

I never said i have problems growing in 12/12 it doesnt differ at all for the Grower, and like i said you should read before wildly accusate

 

Now im done here it seems fanboying goes over a good discussion and as long as im not wanting to get my self in Jail for the rest of my life you wont belive me anyways

So have fun and good luck with all your Grows

 

cheers

[Rabi]

Wow fascinating structure ! Thanks man good to know. I will sleep better because my sativas in this grow worried me a bit. Did you already harvest ? Can you give me smoke report? I rly want this Zamaldelica for my next grow but I am unsure  between it and Panama.

 

both are amazing strain... dificult to choose

harvest months ago, all gone now, smoke report... well they were a great smoke!!!!

[leyus]

both are amazing strain... dificult to choose

harvest months ago, all gone now, smoke report... well they were a great smoke!!!!

Some people report it is terrifying. Rumours say it is so speed and racy that even c99 seems relaxing in compare with it. Is that true? 

 

What exact hight did you get on them with 12/12 ? 

 

Sorry for so many questions but I have recent sativa obsession  

[leyus]

Ok What ever man

 

How so ? lol

Wild accusations flying again...

I never said i have problems growing in 12/12 it doesnt differ at all for the Grower, and like i said you should read before wildly accusate

 

Now im done here it seems fanboying goes over a good discussion and as long as im not wanting to get my self in Jail for the rest of my life you wont belive me anyways

So have fun and good luck with all your Grows

 

cheers

First you say plants went full retard and killed themselves in 12/12 grow not too mention lower resign production if they survived for a change. Now you say you don't have problems with 12/12. To me dying plants and low resign production is usually problem (had that in my first few outdoor grows) but we might have different look at what problems are.

 

I see those sativas here and they are amazing. Doesn't look to me like sissy genetics at all and doesn't look like full retard, rather opposite it looks amazing that you can homegrown pure sativa. This is basically landrace and most people don't even dare to do it indoor, yet here we have in 12/12 method looking so delicious that I can't stop asking about details! Admit it this is inspiring grow, I was so scared going pure sativa but seeing that I feel motivated and ready. This is what this plant does to you and if 12/12 can bring landrace to my wardrobe? I love it and you shouldn't give it bad name without proof because it might mean a lot to someone who have limited space and needs medicine or someone who just needs it fast. 

[Vertox]

Killing them selfs: Cannot carry theyr own Wheigt and wil split at internodes not growable without massive Support.

Lower Resinproduction: Not equal to the Resinproduction from Plants under normal Cycle, not meaning "Bad" Resinproduction.

I hope this clears some things up..

And im repeating my self over and over again im not a Fan of 12/12 Growing,tho like i said, i see that it is a suitable Methode for many Growers with limited Spaceand it is suitable for say98% of the Strains commercialy aviable.

have a nice evening

cheers

[jankahar]

super lemon haze 12/12 from seed in hydro, took almost half of my dr120 alone, amazing resin productions and has been same with the clones, no change 12/12 had no effect on resin productiong, there was no issues coused by light

 

big bang 12/12 from seed in hydro approx day 40 of flowering again no issues

 

you keep making excuses and yet cant provide any kind of data that makes sense.... and we should take you seriously.... im not sure what you did wrong with your plants but so far you havent contributed in any way with your posts, if you dont have the info or evidence of 12/12 light cycle from seed couses less resin production or making your plants die spontaneously (that was first time i heard some one blame light for killing plant and not grower) please do but untill that stop making excuses about some fan boys as i dont know what you mean by that, i dont think you know what it means when you use it in this context as there is nothing that indicates towards it in this thread... maybe you are the one looking for the ego boost, if it makes you feel good i can be your fan from now on:)

 

''Killing them selfs: Cannot carry theyr own Wheigt and wil split at internodes not growable without massive Support.
Lower Resinproduction: Not equal to the Resinproduction from Plants under normal Cycle, not meaning "Bad" Resinproduction.
I hope this clears some things up..''

 

again these are all false issues that are coused by other things not the damn light cycle:D  i can not even express properly how stupid the claims sound like and it only proves you have never studied the plants

[ManUbuntu]

Vertox, the light cycle wasn't the problem, it was either the nutes or medium. If you had really done it I'm sure that 5 diff strains wouldn't "die" because of 12/12. no way man...

Rabi and jankahar, perfect example of 12/12. you keep up!

now my 2€ on 12/12:

did run it and still do for personal smoke my setup is: 1x 600w hps that is nonstop on 12/12. I have made a octagon from drain pipe(orange for sewer, 125mm diameter) there is space for 32 plants and they grow in 20cm pipe(100mm) filled with RW. I flood the octagon 2x a day. now, contrary to H.R. octagon with 4 floors I just have one. I have a separate "room" for the mother and clones(since I need just 3-5/week it's pretty small) so every time a plant is done for harvest I just replace it with a good rooted clone etc...

now I work from clones mostly but I still had to crack the first seed one day. when I had a lot from a unknown strains I did a lot of 12/12 from seed. when it was sprout I put it in a final pot of RW and wait till it came out. at few cm of height I just put it into 12/12 and that's it. no extra science, no "killing themselves" or "low resinproduction". the results are a single cola plants(sativa-just like Rabi) and short mofos of bushy indicas(but I don't grow that anymore)

anyway, 12/12 is amazing grow technique in any size, you do not need to exceed the 2gal pot and you can put the seed directly in it from start(not even sprouted). than just take the ones that sprouted good and fast to flower and keep an eye on the rest. if it doesn't start gowing in a few days take it out and put a new one in.

growing is fun and you HAVE to try it yourself to see how it goes in practise. coz theory is one thing but room full of bab botches is a torally diff story

stay safe and keep on growing!

peace

man

[Vertox]

Like i said i dont even give a single Crp if you believe me or not lol

Im on this Forum to share my expirience and Tastst who decides to believe and who not is not my Problem.

And yes it was for sure the nutes or the medium as it was the same as on the normal cycle but hey logic doesnt apply in the Internets

Sadly the real knowlagelevel in this Forum is getting worse and Worse, all the members who delivered Quality are gone.

Jankahar dont worry i still remeber half a Year ago how you told everyone your weed is the best and we all smoke garbage and showed us a Bud with mold on it so you got from absolute Chump to Expert Grower in half a Year ? congrats for that

I see my intel is not of any intresst as you make your own Truth.

I wish you all best in the Future maybe you learn how to not be a complete asshat somewhen

cya Strainhunters

[leyus]

Oh come on guys please don't get personal. 

 

Even after 10 years of outdoor growing I got mold on my plants in my very last outdoor season with over 100 plants at the time, plenty of crop wasted. 

 

My indoor on the other hand is completely amateur 6.5 l pots and 300W LED and I still think I got too much  weed from my previous indoor grows, way more then I smoke. Not because my harvest is so awesome I just don't smoke whole day long as I used to. Being now percy grower (I wasn't ever commercial but I had big group of friends and sharing is caring ) doesn't change fact that over 15 years from my first grow I still love watching videos, reading books and forums about growing weed. Also those few years I was off growing changed, LEDs, new nutes, new approach, new genetics, new breeders so much new stuff! I learn every day. 

 

What I am trying to say is: we all love this plant, we all learn every day whether we like to admit it or not, we are all big community, we all do mistakes. If we keep bashing one way of growing (I used to hate autos I admit, now I admire what progress breeders made with them ), one light, one type of nutes or each other we will just discourage new guys from joining our community and finding what it best in it, love for plant, shared knowledge and not discriminating each other for the way we grow. I am still not a big enthusiast of autos but hey if one patient can get some relief from it and he wouldn't grow if not 100 days quick grow from start to finish then I think it is all good whether I like it or not and I shouldn't bitch about it. 

 

Come one guys stop arguing we all had our say on subject, there is tons of information about it on internet we don't need to write about it any more. And I am sorry if I upset someone just attack on 12/12 got on my nerve and when I'm high sometimes I like good rant I didn't mean to do that and I hope I shared my view on 12/12 clear enough and there is nothing to add. 

Peace guys! 

[silclay]

Man this is amazing, is it from ACE seeds? Because I was thinking about Zamaldelica for a while but I was a bit afraid because of my limited space (1.6m). Did you had to  lolipop a lot to get such a main steam bud concentration ? 

I am so jealous

i am growing zamaldelica outdoors and they are well over 2 meters and I'm scared Shirtless that my neighbours will grass on me - pardon the pun