How long do you VEG before flowering ?

[Bam-Bhole]

Hey guys + gals .. I know that a lot of you growing perpetual harvest grow 12/12 from seed - Is the easiest and fastest plus if you only got 1 space to grow in it is a problem growing young plants next to those in flower already but after a while I decided to grow some plants the traditional way - giving them 18 hours of MH lights. I think 3 weeks is the minimum, 5 weeks is about the longest I Vegged my girls. I look for a few signs when I change to flowering : Check if there are some white roots visible at the bottom/side holes to see if the rooting is proper and count if there are at least 3 real layers of stems developed and if they are bushy enough. Growing lots of new material on each internode....

Usually a plant should be 30 cm tall but some Indicas are so bushy - Caboose + Kushes that they take longer to grow tothat height, since the internodes are too closeto each other at that early stage. A bushy plant of say 25 cm is better than a stretchy one at 35 cm imo.

What is your way of deciiding when to change from 18 to 12 hours ? O do you just follow a timeline of x weeks ?

[gonzosghost]

Hey dude

I go by size usually but it all comes down to how much plants you want to grow, how much height you have to grow them and how strong your light setup is A few differing factors change the decision making process

If you don't care how much plants you have at once then do a sea of green and veg for only a few days They won't get too big and you can maximise the yield with short grow times

If you can only grow 1 or 2 plants then go for a longer veg, this all depends on how much height you have If you have a room size area then you can veg for quite some time, get a good yield from a 1.5m+ plant Cannabis stretches 2 or 3 times the size once you flip depending on the strain so be careful not to flip too late or you will have to bend and twist your plants to fit in your grow space.

I have vegged too long before and its just a waste of time and nutes Unless you want to grow a tree of course I think it all depends on how tall you want them to be and that generally depends on how much watts you have. I wouldn't grow a 2m plant with anything less than a 600w if you don't want the first metre of the plant to be a mess of fluffy buds. A 400w does not penetrate deep enough through the canopy of a 2m beast! Lol The bottom half of the plant never does well. My rule is to get as much bud as close to my lights as possible so I do a SOG I flip them at 6in They are so small that the bottom buds are still getting a serious amount of light giving me solid lower buds Of course, cloning also helps this

Some people also like to wait until pre-flowers show before flipping or until the 6th node appears as it can stress out your clones but in my experience this has not been an issue

I can go on about the differing factors for some time as there is so much that goes into the planning of the flip Essentially it comes down to space

Damn I can ramble, lol, does anyone even understand what the hell im on about? Haha

[Bam-Bhole]

Yes I know exactly what you want to say - I know about all that. I only wanted to get some info from the people here about their experiences and on which scheme they have settled for different purposes. A tall growing sativa gets not more than 2 weeks real VEG. with real Veg I mean EXACTLy - 7 days after the seed is visible over the soil surface or you see the first green. The next 7 days do not count imo since the girls are not actually growing but developing roots and start the first set of true leaves - once that is done and you got a stretch of the 4 green leaves over the first 2 leaves, that fall off anyway - then I start counting VEG time ! All of that can get confusing in a discussion-if someone says 3 weeks from seed and means 3 weeks since he pushed the roooted seed in soil he actually i talking about a 2 week VEG time - Seen ?

Okay once that has been cleared 2 weeks for a Sativa 3 weeks for a strong Hybrid and 4 weeks for a real bushy Kush or Indica that gets only 50 cm tall at harvest like my Caboose bush should do .. I mean waiting for such a plant to get 30 cm's would mean unnnecessary waste of time + energy unless you want to grow real big trees. I am about to decide when and how exactly to change from Veg. The King's Kush was planted around August 14th, means it was a little 4 leavesd seedling on that date, so I ad another 3 days to that and that means it got 2 weeks in August and 10 days in September of proper VEg at 18 hours with a 400 watt MH disttance had to be around 45 cm even under a Spreader, since the temp went up to 30 degrees Celsius at that distance. These Metal Halides get terrible HOT, so i think it would be wiser to change the lights first and lower the distance from the tops to ca 30 cm or so and stick to 18 hours for another weeks, since I also got a Caboose + 2 white widow who are exactly 1 week younger and they should get a bit taller. i am happy with the development but the height is not at the wanted height yet. but hey they may grow in flowering just as well ..The plants can grow up to 1m20 no prob, but usually 70 cm to 1 meter depending on the Indica part in the strain is normal ...If I had a real greenhouse or 1000 watt lights i would let them get taller of course..

I show you :

This is a seedling I would call at Day 3 of VEG - Royal Cheese in the brown round pot plus AK-47 + Amnesia Haze Autos)

The girl outdoors in the smrt pot is one of the 2 very bushy Widows grown since 3 August 20 plus 3 - short of 3 weeks

The plants in the back are King's Kushes with 1 week more - one in square pot 2 in smart pots - The one in the middle is a Caboose also short of 3 weeks in Veg..

Will start changing lights half and half from tomorrow then changing to flowering over the weekend..

The tall one in the TEKU pot is ready to be put in flower although it is not yet 30 cm tall but 25 cm imo.

Still for the benefit of the crop I give her a tad longer - You can see at this distance temp is 26 degrees on the soil surface, so I cannot lower the distance from the lambs.. r/h is 56% which is good

[SukonmiSkunk]

i grow in a scrog style, always kinking tops down and out to spread the canopy. I grow in a recirc hydro system..yes.. with straight perlite. So i dont grow plants like you would out doors.

i usually wait until the room is around 1/2-3/4's full.. this basically means as soon as the plants are about the size of the pot in spread i turn them to flower.

ofc the plants will stretch like crazy, so ill be kinking/tying tops down right up until the 3rd week of flower when theyve stopped most of the stretch and the buds have set, then i just let go till finish.

its an art form to get the maximum yield from my room, i dont like to see gaps, as gaps means lost yield.

maximum yield is important to me, as efficiency is everything, with power bill clocking into the 1000's.. the room HAS to produce, or im just wasting my time.

edit: also, i will only grow with clones, to keep the room uniform, and so it all matures at the same time. I wont put seedlings in my room, especially if i dont know how they grow or react. Every strain is different and unless i can grow 2 very similar strains in structure and flowering time i wont mix a room.

so ill grow seeds until i find a mother and clone it. Ive seen too many times people fill their room only to lose a big part of it to males or hermies. This causes loss of yield when theres no need for it. with clones, the turn around time is around 11-12 weeks. Usually about 3-4 weeks grow cycle

[TheOne]

I'm with everything that you guys have said

I can add that you can train the plants and still pull off substantial yields

I've heard time and time again some ppl say that some plants don't respond well to training, but I haven't come across one in 34 tries.

But with that said, by training the plants you can control the height and veg a sativa for months and end up with a plant shorter than 2m.

I think it's an art form to train the plants into little indoor bushes haha

I think Gonzo makes a great point tho in terms of how much veg is necessary to pull off that monster yield..Personally I think between 4-6 wks at this point, but that subjected to change im sure. But in a SOG im what's been said

I think maybe it's be a good place to start by watching the autos and seeing how long the veg for before they star flowering That's my "highdea" for the day haha

I REALLY can't wait to see about the Sweet Mango

Bless

[Bam-Bhole]

Great points made ! I know that the way I grow is joke business from a commercial pov. All the efffort spending 100 uro and more just on seeeds growing 6 strains at the same time and in the end yielding maybe half a pound in 3 month if lucky is not very clever from a money making standing..lol

But I like to see a lot of different strains growing and of course smoking a nice variety is something I really like but sometimes I wish I had more success with clones but all attempts so far were futile. i guess the fact that the real gel for cloning is not available - illegal in my country - is a reason why the rooting is so difficult or I simply make a mistake- I rally would like to grow the Caboose as a mother plant IF I knew I could get clones from it .. I will def. try it since i am really fond of this strain. The weed is so damn great to smoke and the plants grow bushy and short , so half and half would be a good alternative for my next run. Maybe i can order some Clone Ex Gel from the UK via eBay.. However the days I grew 12/12 from seed and with Autos it took between 18 days and a ittle less than 4 weks till the first pre-flowers appeared and after 1 full month you could see the first little flowers turning into buds on the tops I think with HPS the Kush would show pre flowers now judging it's development. So from tomorrow they will get 18 hours but HPsS and a lower distance. From monday on they get 12/12, not sure if I shorten the flowering 2 hours per day ? Anyone tried that ? OTH the shock of a sudden change might spark up the flowering more than that..

Lets hear more experiences - this is an important aspect of growing so we all can benefit from each other's experiences if we share them...

ONE

[TheOne]

Honey, Aspirin, bark from a Willow tree, aloe vera gel <- All these things help with cloning

U don't need clonex by a stretch

And as far as 12/12 from seed for me, sex showed between days 20-35 I'd say, so 3-5 wks veg seem like it'd be adequate no doubt

This speaking on behalf on my most recent 12/12 babies.

[Bam-Bhole]

Yeah, will try another method next, around 3 to 4 at longest 5 week are realistic when it comes to flowering, agreed. Girls looking good under the yellow HPS right now. The lights are much much closer now - less than 30 cm and it still is less hot than at 50 cm with the MH.

[Pi2]

Hi, all above is pure true. I veg. Sativa only for 2 weeks(avoid Tent size problem) and Hybrid / Indica up to 25/30cm-Around 3 weeks time(add to all around 5 days for seedling). About swap TIME= 1 hour a day from 18 to 12. slowly but works a bit better and it takes 6 days-so is less stress for plants I veg under Neon's 110W 4 pin 6500K it's far cooler and less power(U should try one it's very nice lamp 11K Lumens link - http://www.hydroponi...-110w-1241.html) . I'm growing only few plants in DR90.

Keep Growing! Peace!

[Bam-Bhole]

Hey Pi2 . Good post. I got one 150 watt T5 Neon with various lambs and when the room is used for flowering I raise seedlings under them in a cupboard...They like it..

[delta9cloud]

looking nice, are they under a light or natural? 

[Salvatore Riina]

This is one year old thread delta9. i think he finished flowering